Beckenham & Bromley 3 v Hastings & St Leonards 3

En Passant cup FINALS Thu 9th May 2019
BoardHomeBeckenham & Bromley 3Hastings & St Leonards 3Away
1 (B) 166D (159)
S
Barlerin, Samuel
1 - 0
G
Cove, Henry
159A (164)
2 (W) 153C (156)
B
Sands, Alan VH
½ - ½
S
Wheeler, James M
160A (156)
3 (B) 150D (159)
S
Jiang, Freddy
0 - 1
S
Hann, Chris N
145D (146)
4 (W) 138D (131)
S
Jasserand, Pascal
0 - 1
S
Bryant, Marc A
131A (136)
5 (B) 122D (120)
B
Mourant, Malcolm P
½ - ½
S
Woodhams, Mason
129A (134)
6 (W) 110D (106)
G
Newman, Martin E
0 - 1
G
Willson, Gary
119B (113)
Penalty0 - ½
Average1402 - 3½Average141

Last updated by Zia Mehmet at Sun 12th May 2019 22:19 Reported By Marc bryant Verified By Malcolm Mourant

Comments

Hastings & St. Leonards Chess Club is penalised one half point penalty for being over-graded. Revised Match score 2 v 3.5
I must say that I am not very happy that a team wins Semi-Final match with an illegal team. I realise that whole team is only three grading points in total above tournament limit so truthfully a negligible over-grading, but nevertheless, it was an illegal team.
I trust same 'illegal' team will not play in En Passant Final, but if it does, I will penalise over-grading by whole point in Final.
DOUGLAS SMITH
KENT CHESS TOURNAMENT SECRETARY

Douglas
you seem to think that this was done Deliberately which it was not
the rules state
Note: exceeding the limit is against the rules. The penalties are not to be seen as licence to do it. They are intended for the case where overgrading is accidental.
This was the case
Furthermore on realizing a miscalculation I immediately informed my opposite number however only 4 hours to match it was to late for me to change the team
Your statement I trust same 'illegal' team will not play in En Passant Final, but if it does, I will penalise over-grading by whole point in Final.
This this is just stupid if you know that if a team has been deliberately fielded over the grading limit then that team should be defaulted all other cases the rules should apply
Maybe you think we deliberately played by an ineligible player in the semi final of the steveson
Time

While I have no doubt that it was accidental, it did strike me on the night that the penalty for over-grading is virtually pointless in a semi-final.

As it stands, the only match outcome that would have been impacted by the penalty is if Hastings had won on board count a match that was originally tied 3-3

All other outcomes are unchanged - and so perhaps the penalty rules need to be reviewed so that they actually have an implication?

wrong its was not possable for the match result to be 3 3 has Hastings wood loss the match 3 to 2.5 hastings had to win the match by a clear point

Not wrong at all

What I am saying is that the only over-the-board result that is changed by the penalty would be a 3-3 draw where Hastings won on board count.

In that case, the penalty would make it 2.5 v 3 and so a win becomes a loss.

All other possible results are not changed by the penalty:
Hastings winning from 6-0 down to 3.5-2.5 are still wins after the penalty, and all Beckenham winning results are still wins after the penalty

So, the penalty itself is of zero consequence to the overgrading team except in the case of a 3-3 win by tie-break

For an honest mistake I am getting pretty fed up with this
Firstly Doug should have kept his personal feelings to himself instead of opening up a can of Worms and by suggesting that he would circumnavigate the rules in the finalthis was just stupid
I have already stated any team who deliberately fields an over graded side should be defaulted had not as Doug suggests have a point deducted which incidentally against the rules
In relation to you your arguments which make no sense if the rules are not fit for the semi-final then they are clearly not fit for the group stage as the penalty is exactly the same
Incidentally I did not write the rules had I done so I wood have done a better job
As a Bromley and Beckenham player had the right to express the view however I fail to see what you’re getting at
Our average grade was 140.5 for this Bromley and Beckingham only had to draw the match from any of the six boards and Hastings had to win by a clear point

the match was won and lost on boards three and four where we were outgraded and manage to win them boards do you believe that the match result was adversely affected by the .5 over grade
I be interested to know what you would have done in a similar situation cancel the match at 3 hours notice taken a player out would not have helped or taking the penalty ½ and informed the opposite number which is what I did
Lastly there is no good moaning about the rules after the event whether it be a good or a bad rules
Far better to come up with some better rules
None of this is an excuse it is against the rules to field a deliberate over strengths side
However this was not the case

I would also point we the fielded ineligible player in the in the Stevenson which we won 4 2 ended up losing on board count which we accepted without complaint as the rules are the Rules